Gnostic Pneumatherapy (The Gnostic-Jungian Approach)


Welcome everybody to the finding Hermes podcast. I hope you’re ready to go with the god of the mind through those doors, doors of perception doors that you uh will find uh the best thing about you

and where you need to be in this world, and I’m very excited today to have Dr. Joseph Lancaster with us. Joseph, thank you very much for coming on and finding Hermes. Absolutely thank you so much for inviting me it’s very nice, pleasure is all mine so for the audience

uh, who might want to know to tell us about your journey into heresy for lack of better words or the

esoterica jury the heresy

well, uh, first of all, uh

I was born in 1971 born and raised in Los Angeles California

and I joined the air force when I was 19

when I decided to become a psychologist, either that or a computer scientist, and as my brother

who’s a computer scientist told me you know it’s a whole different kind of logic being a psychologist

versus a computer scientist calculus and all, so I thought to myself

well, you know, based on my upbringing, I was raised very religiously, and I think that

Jesus Christ, the buddha probably relates a little bit more to being a psychologist

so that’s what helped me to make my decision during my time in service

and then, after my time in service, I went to graduate school and

it was during my graduate school time in Los Angeles that I met a dear friend of mine who turned me on to

Joseph Campbell, the famous worldwide mythologist

and there is when I started to break free for about three years slowly, a lot

of uh blood, sweat, and tears, so to speak, I have

breaking out of my mainstream mentality of Christianity, it was very difficult to

do but worth the while and um, and that was around the time when i

I started hearing as well about Dr. Stephan A. Hoeller through the grapevine, depending on who i

was studying with or working with as an intern and

in more recent times, I got married to my Polish wife. I was awesome; uh, she’s

a with an amazing marriage and I uh with her we are both together

uh, the owners of divine life therapy, which is really

uh, the home of my gnostic pneumotherapy approach

uh, which is my big contribution to the field of psychology. I know we’re going to talk about that a little more in

depth later on wonderful, wonderful yeah glad thanks for sharing your story as I say of deep

programming it’s never easy yeah, you mentioned uh dr Stephan A. Hoeller obviously, he’s uh I’ve

I interviewed him a few times for an Aeon Bite I’ve had the honor of being at a

service that he officiated or was the bishop only once, but it was memorable

I’ll never forget it; fortunately, I’m not down in LA. I can’t enjoy these things

more than that and his bc recordings are just amazing. I advise the

audience to find those; you can find many of them on youtube. He’s done an incredible job in moving the gnostic and

other esoteric uh uh ideas to the mainstream in his books are, of course

great, his book uh uh yeah, the gnostic Jung and the seven

sermons of the dead are such powerful it’s not just well written but are so emotional, so evocative full of pathos

if you want to know more about Abraxas, it’s a great book um, so how did how has he influenced

you was he the one that really got you into the whole gnostic ethos

yes, uh, okay, so uh, can I tell you maybe a little story, sure, please

we love stories. Yeah, as I say in this probably from joseph Campbell, people don’t listen to facts in this world but

stories that are another thing that’s how our brains work yeah, okay okay good, so uh

and I will admit I have my little memorable notes here on to the side, okay, so uh just so long ago, okay

so as I was kind of saying earlier, uh, as I was an intern

this is back in the 90s, uh late 90s

and uh, through the grapevine, fellow workers, I was working at a hospital

and um, some other places, and they heard about my earlier writings

where I was uh, for example, my dissertation where I was comparing fundamentalist Christians with

non-fundamentalist Christians 

and so once these people heard about my

interest in non-fundamentalist Christians as well, uh

they had uh mentioned to me some uh wonderful, mysterious guy named dr Stephan A. Hoeller

oh really, you might want to see that guy talk to him. Oh, okay, great, you know, and so

uh of course, back then, in the 90s, you know, before technology was what it is

today you know I’m relying on the phone book let me find this guy you know and 4-1-1 and we don’t we

know we never heard that place Ecclesia Gnostica, Hollywood, California or this guy, and but I heard was uh he was somewhere

located on Hollywood boulevard at that time, and so I drove up, and down the hollow boulevard I couldn’t find him right i

now I realized that I did actually see the facade of his tiny little chapel at that time

uh, which had, I think, a little itty bitty cross on the door, but I couldn’t see that I was driving by, so I kept missing

out on, you know, seeing him earlier anyway, um so

um what happened was, oh actually, what happened was um

I was in a Borders bookstore in west la; uh this is all while I was doing my

dissertation and i saw a wonderful book called uh Jung and the lost gospels that caught

my eye across the room, and so I just ran to that book

practically and I bought it, and I started uh referencing him in my dissertation, and I said, you know, I think

that guy I keep hearing about, you know, I’m not sure, but I think this is the guy, right but again, I can’t

find him uh kind of like a good ancient gnostic, very hidden and mysterious, right

right, right, okay, so he’s very appropriate anyway so

um uh, and then one day I went to a whole foods bookstore

uh, I don’t know if you know about that actually, no whole foods um uh health stores excuse me

um uh, for healthy food and you don’t have to have a lot of free magazines on the outside, you know, especially in la’s

very much like that, and uh, I was just kind of looking through it; this is this guru that guru on the back pages all of

a sudden, I see this little tiny ad dr Stephan A. Hoeller Ecclesia Gnostica, Hollywood, California at

you know what? That’s that guy from that book I just bought and referenced in my dissertation as

well, as whom everybody else has been talking about, and there actually was a

address and a phone number for free lectures every Friday night

eight o’clock and uh and I uh what was the subject about it

was uh Castaneda? I believe Carlos Castaneda yeah yeah, I believe

that’s what the subject was about, so I went down there and checked out the lecture. This was back in 2001

and I’ve been with him ever since; wow, okay so

so I’ve been with dr Dr. Stephan Hoeller at the Gnostic Society in Los Angeles now for a total of 21 years

and uh I’ve attended his church services, his lectures uh meeting with him

personally, you name it, and um, he’s even blessed me to uh uh

this last Christmas, for example, to even uh send me a Christmas card

calling me his son, you know, and although I’ve often referenced him as my

spiritual grandfather, so either way you look at it, it’s all good um uh, because we’ve been very committed

to each other for a long time, um, on the very subjects we’re going to be talking about today

uh, so that’s kind of the little story right there, um

and all this came again out of the whole person magazine that I found from the

um whole food store, okay yeah, and uh, a lot of synchronicities did

you know about synchronicities back then where you’re like there is meaning driving me there is purpose

that’s true yeah that’s true I’ve had to relearn that concept many times

from dr Dr. Stephan Hoeller at the Gnostic Society in Los Angeles, because it’s a pretty mysterious concept, but yeah, there was synchronicity there that’s very

meaningful, what a wonderful coincidence that, um, I finally found him, and he found me and

uh, that’s what makes me who I am today as a spiritual psychologist

uh that I am to where I can serve my uh patients and my initiates through

gnostic pneumotherapy in such a way where they can have that new awareness

that new beginning by getting past this mundane consciousness

into a more creative consciousness to find the gnosis that informs them of who they really are

versus the limitations of this ego that uh blinds us and, therefore

uh brings forth more shadow to influence our ego in a way that is

very unhealthy uh because of the ignorance because of the the

limitations of our daily consciousness. Sorry I know I’m jumping a little ahead

here but speech these, uh, I know off-the-cuff speeches are the best, and this is

what people need to hear because, as you said uh, part of the gnostic idea

is that? Yeah, it’s ignorance, but just because you have you know the annum Nessies that Philip doesn’t mean

There will be ignorance that will wash you the next day. You’ll forget the simple

rules of self-knowledge contemplation, so I tell people, yeah, we need these

daily reminders, so sometimes we need that fridge magnet, spirituality cliche mantras; you know anything because

the whole world is trying to make us forget who we are, and we don’t help our own cause; that’s correct, yes, yes, yes

no, no, no wonder why again why the Egyptians, for example, had their jewelry or their rings and

things of that sort it wasn’t just for you know, fun and show it was there were reminders

do not forget raw et cetera et cetera; yeah, they just didn’t want to post it on Instagram to look

to them, everything was important, so you know uh Scott Smith and his wife Sandra to he’s been a guest oh yes

yes, awesome guy, wonderful Scott Smith, very supportive

[Music] wonderful man who’s also very close to dr Stephan A. Hoeller, yes

yeah, past yes, and I always enjoy his take so so awesome so that some people might be

saying sometimes they say uh well okay these guys are you know we have uh this therapist

we’re talking about modern days, but these guys are bringing all these ancient dead heretics who were

fighting the orthodox church and the archons and the demiurge and all that but

I think you uh well what would you say to that that uh how

does Gnosticism translate today? I think we hit you hit it on the head, right it’s the

famous uh oracle of Delphi that the gnostics took to heart and

many religions don’t; it’s a simple idea of knowing thyself

right, so how does this translate today? Yeah, how does Gnosticism translate

in a way that helps people know themselves, uh you just have ignorance

well, you know, I uh think about even movies like lord of the

rings or star wars etc. etc. uh maybe harry potter

for some people, which I also know, dr Stephan A. Hoeller lectured on some of those movies

those are one of the many ways that Gnosticism relates to

today’s need to awaken to be more mindful, which is a popular buzz term

for example um, millions go to see star wars or lord of

the rings or harry potter, and oh yeah, it’s cool the effects and this step or the other

but many people don’t realize on a much deeper level beyond all those uh

bells and whistles and effects it’s really touching their soul, moving

their soul in some way, expanding their

mundane consciousness to be a more super consciousness in some way

uh, for example, you mean that I could possibly be like luke skywalker and

become a yoda myself or an obi-wan Kenobi or me like he is in the latest movies

you know so so um yeah uh, and I think in the latest movie the the

girl’s name is ray she is uh something like what you skywalker

used to be when he was just starting uh to learn the ways of the force right

uh and so uh yeah the ways of the force the ways of the archetypes huh the unconscious

archetypes and how to work with those forces no matter how positive or negative but to

to uh uh if we know the ways of the force that is really within us

uh in this 2022 existence, no matter whether it’s through the way

of dreams or visions or aha experiences or mythologies by whatever means we use

we can learn the ways of our unconscious forces where the archetypes live archetypes meaning those superior

realities those universal truths so that we can um come to terms with

ourself you know who am i answer that question who am I? I’m asking people in my intake sessions

that all the time and most people don’t know who they are, and that’s why they’re in

therapy right well why am I suffering this way right you know

um, however, fortunately, I also have other clientele

that become what I call my initiates because they’re interested in going

beyond just standard psychotherapy they, they want to walk the path

uh their own path and uh even an agnostic at one time told

me a long time ago oh, okay, I’ll try this out because everything else I’m doing is not working, so I’ll cut out this path

but I tell you what; I’m going to find my own path

on the path, whoa, that was so cool. I loved it when he said that because now I’ve been, I’ve

been saying that to everybody now you know exactly I’m just

in an uh basic way or generic way

giving you an example of what a psychospiritual path looks like step by step

but most importantly, I do want you, no matter what background

you come from to find your own unique path on the path

so that way, you can drive your own meaning of what your dreams mean to you or your

visions, right, so um as long as the person comes from any

kind of love tradition or even if they’re agnostic or

even if they’re atheists, you know I mean as long as they’re willing and ready to do an inner deep path work like Carl Jung Swiss psychiatrist used to help his clients with then it was all good

that’s how I want to help people, i want to help people to help themselves

go into the depths of their soul in order to make their own inner

self-discoveries from that mystery of their own being by participating in the

mystery of their own being through those mysterious mirrors which

we call dreams, visions, and mythologies. It’s from that mystery that you

discover those parts of yourself that you did not know before

so that way, you can um integrate those different parts of yourself and no longer be shattered

glass with seven deadly sins, right- greed,

lust, anger, pride, well, we put all those pieces back together again, you become a wholeness of

oneness like the gnostics and Carl Jung talked about because with that oneness that

wholeness uh, as dr Stephan A. Hoeller has taught me, what the root of the word wholeness is

holy, hell, holy health, wholeness

okay, and like Jesus’s beautiful halo, right uh, which is beautiful, not fragmented and

ugly and therefore, by having that wholeness that balance

we have freedom from suffering and or causing suffering as much as possible

so again, um, as also dr Stephan A. Hoeller taught me when we’re

unbalanced, that’s when all the emotional problems come forth, so we need that balance again to be as

free as possible from suffering and or causing it via the wholeness we have attained

so no wonder why Carl Jung said the patient or, in this case, the initiate needs to be

responsible for doing your own inner work. If people are not responsible for doing their own inner work through dreams

visions aha experiences mythology ritual you name it then how are we going to

make those self-discoveries um come to grips with ourselves or coming

to terms with ourselves if we’re in a low vibration, as quantum physics would say

then we have more of those qualities like the archons 

like the pride, the anger, etc., but when we’re of a higher vibration

as quantum physics talks about, then we have more of the traits like the angels,

compassion, peace, truth, right

balance, so in other words, there’s a transformation that happens we were once of a lower

vibration where we were dishonest, and now we’re about the truth, which i talk

about my gnostic pneumatherapy [ Gnostic therapy] book, we are no longer of the anger, but now we

have transformed into the peace of who we really are on a much higher

level of existence, knowledge gnosis knowledge, divine knowledge

but it’s not just a head knowledge it’s a knowledge that is uh of sight and sound

it is a direct experience type of knowledge like the gnostics, and Carl Jung had

so that we can make these self-discoveries that heal us to come closer to the

divine, and therefore we become more like the divine

because the divine is a mirror reflection of who we are

uh the divine is anthropomorphic in many ways and we are

heteromorphic, we are a mirror reflection of one another

kind of like that greek statue where you see the twins, uh holding

each other’s hand, one twin is mortal, one twin is immortal, but that is us you see a reflection

and and as the old saying goes, you can’t beat god so

so if you can’t beat god, then why not, um

be what religion is really about, which is not heady religion, not organized

religion that’s limited, but uh

the act of becoming we’re becoming who we once were

who we really are as a gnostic say uh where we came from who we are and where

we’re going so by having that religious experience which is what I’ve been talking about this whole time about by having more

religious experience as Carl Jung talks about; we are in the act of becoming

that oneness once again, even the bible talks about how god knew before you were born

in your best condition at that time, that’s what the soul’s journey is all about is to go

back to that original condition when you were at your best in mind, body ,spirit

even beyond body, right um you know of the spirit so

that is our life’s goal; no wonder why carl Jung says that your life’s goal is to be conscious that’s what I’m speaking

about this whole time is the ways you can become conscious and

overall become who you once were even before you were born

You can’t beat that no, no that’s really well said great

In summation, yeah,Carl Jung did say the gnostics were history’s first uh depth psychologist

and I think yeah, the gnostics really saw were one of the few you could put the

Neoplatonic to the hermetic, they saw that what we were was just the tip of the iceberg, and there was an ocean

of all of the different realities like you said archetypes and like Joseph Campbell said, all the gods, the heavens, the devils

are within us they are energies coming up and what the gnostic said is okay we need to listen because if we listen to

this ocean, or like Carl Jung would say, we listen to our soul that’s where individuation is, so would

you say gnostic pneumotherapy is about listening to

everything that’s happening within you

right uh, or what is the path

right well, actually, let me bounce off what you just said, so another little lesson dr Stephan A. Hoeller has taught me

to relate to what he just said is that, um

when you have an intuitive experience, okay, or what I call in my book a gnosis

perception okay when you have that gnosis perception when you’re in a dream or a vision

uh through active imagination, let’s say, um 

it’s not just intuition okay many times, the intuition can attach itself by the

source’s divine love and grace to help us the intuition will attach itself to

our emotions to our thoughts to our sensations, even

during that actual experience, so you see, we’re getting a full plethora of experience that is definitely

possible which is beautiful and awesome that moves us even more

uh to be inspired to keep doing that kind of individuation work

uh, which I call in my book, um uh the gnosis integration process

so I have a few offshoot terms from Carl

Jung, again, calls it same individuation thing that the developmental process is a

gnosis integration process to lead you to a final gnosis integration

uh same thing with his term transcendent function, as I talked to

dr Stephan A. Hoeller about where dr Stephan A. Hoeller agreed with me that i could split that term apart to make it a

little more simple, and where I call it the

great transcendent function which uses the extended transcendent

function, and we’re obviously talking about a connecting principle here, right

so from the source that extended transcendent uh function

is what I call an archetypal soul guide, okay

um it’s a guide obviously that can help

the ego to connect during those dream or visionary experiences to

connect to the different archetypal images

but it is also true that a person may not have an archetypal soul guide they

might per se go it alone, and they’re having these dreams or

visions where they may not have per se a guide obviously, the source is the

ultimate guide nonetheless where they on their own can talk to the different archetypes

in order to make those connections and through the dialogue, they can also assimilate as

I talk about in my book assimilating that wisdom those divine

energies so that, as I was saying before, their dishonesty becomes the truth

their anger becomes peace, so you see slowly but surely

let me put it this way slowly but surely; they are dialoguing and assimilating, integrating

all of that gnosis, and then they’re ready for more, and then they’re ready for more, and then they’re

ready for more, and they become more and more individuated, as Carl Jung would say or

as I call gnosis integration process and as they become more developed in such a way

then it’s all spontaneous in their daily life in their daily life

it spontaneously comes to fruition more easily in other words, think about a bulb

a little bit more simply, you are like a bulb but do you identify

yourself with the bulb, the body, or with the light that’s inside the bowl right

so kind of like on a dimmer switch as you as you put up that knobby

the light gets brighter and brighter and fills the inside right, so you see this is this is the god

the effect I’m talking about of the gnosis where we want to fill up our light bulb

with all of that divine knowledge um healing energy etc. therefore we

can’t help it like the buddha or the Christ, it radiates out of us into the world

right, and people become attracted to us because wow, you got something that I don’t got, I’m just depressed, anxious and miserable, and please, uh, like luke skywalker Yoda show

me the way obi-wan Kenobi show me the way uh Frodo to Gandalf show me the way

right you see that that’s very, very important to

help to heal this world one person at a time but that one person at a time needs

to do their inner work so that we can be a light in this dark world like the like

the gnostics were, and Carl Jung was, and therefore we can inspire other

people, we can become a transformational object for them

right we know an object is often talked about as a person in psychology, but we are transformational. We’re like a mentor

for those people who as well want to transform to help make this world a better place

one person at a time by doing our own inner work via the path work that I have helped to

set forth called gnostic pneumatherapy obviously, there are many path paths out

there to reach the source, right? I’m not the only one, but I offer I offer

through my um training experience, I’ve gained through

dr Stephan A. Hoeller, as well as my own practice etc etc i um

have been writing this book since 2007 long time now because, as dr Stephan A. Hoeller said, this is not

going to be an easy task, so I’ve been writing for a long time this book to set up a

psychospiritual path work where people can step by step, kind of like being in the old greek

mysteries where you where the the the person comes from the masses and walks

into the temple, which is pitch black, and there are torches along the way

and the hero font meets them and helps them as they’re willing and ready along the

way to gain more revelations along the way, more

instruction more ethereal experiences, and then at the end of it all the

the mystery was revealed right, and as part of that mystery, I’m using

Carl Jung’s Sistema manitous out of his uh red book

uh that mandala gnostic mandala-like uh uh pitch that he drew

I’m doing a different variation of it legally and ethically, of course so that

so that people can have their own experience

based on that basic mandala or

the picture there um to have their own version their own experience

uh similar to what Jung had in order to know thyself and to thine own self be

true via the many worlds, the many levels of

understanding as they journey to the center of it

okay, and uh, you know dr Stephan A. Hoeller has blessed me to approve me

to do this as well um so that i can uh publish this so that uh

therapists can use this uh um mandala of the seven sermons to the dead

that’s my other name, right? No, as dr Stephan A. Hoeller helped me to

cultivate as far as a name for it um

that’s going to be one of the final tools that I utilize with people to give them that wow experience

that reminds me, I was on the phone many years ago with dr Stephan A. Hoeller and dr

Stephan A. Hoeller, before he hung up, he said you know I want you to look at like the last page of the red book

and then we finished our conversation, and right at that moment, I opened up like one of the very last pages of

the red book where that mandala is at, and wow, way like i saw it like in

uh the fourth dimension is like a dome you know, so there’s obviously much more

to that um mandala, that magical circle

then just a two-dimensional um picture, you know so so you see that’s an example

of where a person can hang on to that and go further with that in order to

have many aha experiences as they do their path work

of self-discovery, not knowing who you’re going to meet along the way

but dialogue with them, assimilate them, and then you will eventually get to the

center of that mandala and then

exit out beyond it into the oneness stage of consciousness

as I talk about my book because it’s in the oneness stage of consciousness where you have that full

individuation um individual right as they say in the Italian Latin

that’s wonderful. Yeah very excited about your book, so you mentioned the mystery religion. Uh we

mentioned the gnostics and even Jung the red book, his descent into himself

his guide was Philemon aka Simon magus aka a few other

uh manifestations, but one of the hardest things is to

face not just who you are but face your trauma, your depression, your shadow i

mean the mystery religions you would go down into hades and meet these demons

which were symbolical for your own pain. How do you do that 

Joseph or is it just

painful I don’t want to see. I don’t want to

revisit this stuff. We live in a society where we just want to suppress the pain, suppress the anxiety

put it all on one side and put a happy smile on, but that’s no, you got to go down right

absolutely well, in my book, I do make many references to dante, for example, going

into the inferno uh kind of somewhat similar to Sophia

when she fell out of heaven and went down to the chaos which was all in here right

well, we’ll tell you what first. I want to start off with more of a

classic answer related to the shadow side, um, so you know doing shadow work is very

important as Carl Jung talked about uh because

um well, first of all, what is the shadow, so the shadow is basically, um

made up, you could say of our childhood trauma uh which has not been maybe resolved for

some people the hurt, the disappointment the neglect

uh, you name it, and that makes up a lot of our shadow side right in our personal

uh unconscious mind but also the unlived energies because you know the divine wants us to

be all that we can be, but when we’re not all that we can be, then those uh energies uh become like a weed in our

soul dormant, and that kind of works against us too uh we’re not fully consciously aware

and so this shadow side is kind of like the uh old story of dr

Jekyll, Mr hyde, or banner turned into a hulk right um well I’m Mr nice guy no you’re not

well I’m very giving no you’re not you’re greedy, you know and so and so on right kind of the seven deadly sins

that um Dante was encountering when he went into the inferno right

so when we’re having a dream or a vision and we experience a dark a figure

that um is very scary or painful in some way to us than the

most important thing is for our ego to be present don’t run away

dialogue with it befriend it right and by doing that

we kind of disempower it over our soul and no longer can get the best of us

we’re kind of taking back our original energy if you will so that we can uh make that energy

useful helpful in our life and that energy helps to lift up our soul towards the light thank you Jesus

christ right or buddha or whoever you’re into and yes that shadow side is still there

but it’s of a lower vibration it doesn’t have such easy access to our soul

anymore okay to bring us down uh so

if we’re of a lower vibration once again we’re in trouble because ah we got you again sucker

greed, lust, anger, pride, 

so we need to be of a higher vibration by being responsible and doing this inner-depth work so that we can give a

higher vibration and uh therefore the shadow side within is not

so potent anymore okay uh bringing all this suffering and pain to our lives or

those of others so that is an important part of the Gnostic Pneumatherapy pathway and by

doing that kind of uh shadow work then makes it easier

to have more clairvoyance to have a more clear vision where we can more easily get those

um greater archetypal dreams that come forth or greater archetypal uh visions

to come forth as a matter of fact um can I tell you of

a case example yeah please do

one of my most successful initiates which again is a patient i just call them on initiates because they’re doing

the path work okay in her new awareness her new beginning one of her many wonderful stories was

that um she had come to the session and she said she had a

a dream a scary dream uh but basically the way it went was

uh she was up at a pond and the birds the bees everything was like

spring wonderful and pretty and nice and she started to go down into that

pond and oh having a wonderful time and then as

she was coming out kind of like that scene of lord of the rings you know the fellowship

where that big giant octopus comes out no that’s pretty much what happened in her dream and she’s walking

and she’s walking out of the pond gleefully and then all of a sudden this big giant octopus starts coming after

her and she’s just like all right okay and she gets to the shore

right barely makes it so i said oh okay, that’s interesting so I’ll tell you what, uh and this is of course before the

coronavirus right so I was able to have her lay on the couch so so she lays on couch i said i want you to go back

to the scary part of that dream you had so basically i was helping her to

resolve that dream you could say through active imagination visionary work right

so she’s laying on the couch and she’s speaking to me through and through what’s going on, Dr.

Lancaster I’m there I’m there again at the uh the pond

uh and it’s really ugly this time you know uh like the way I left it and there’s trash all around and it smells

bad it’s dark i can’t see anything that’s happening oh my god okay

so okay okay my feet are now in the water okay good very good keep going

okay now I’m up to my knees I’m so nasty I don’t want to do this it’s i I’m scared and it’s it’s awful smells bad i

can’t see anything what’s going on, so all of a sudden she gets up to like her chest level in the water

what’s happening i can’t believe it the water’s moving

but it’s getting more clear and it doesn’t smell so bad anymore

and then before you know it she would her head was underwater

there’s a beautiful light and I hear uh some beautiful music and someone calling my name

Dr Lancaster it’s god

and god is calling my name and is touching me with his beautiful light

and wants me to come his way. I’m coming

wow she jumped out of the couch and was so happy and gleeful and and and

ever since then she had no depression you know and she’s just so happy and enlightened and her her

individuation since then has been immaculate she’s had so many visions and

dreams of a higher caliber the greater archetypes

like angels and archangels you name it and she’s very uh uh much healed no

wonder i hardly ever see her anymore you know you know once in a blue moon

i’ll hear from uh she’ll come to session and give me reports of how she’s you know still on her um

successful uh path work uh because you know the pathway never really ends right

um but just a very much a success case um and uh I’m very very happy for her that

she’s been so uh uh willing to share these wonderful success stories with me which is in my

book so uh that’s kind of how it works uh now there is one other part i don’t want to forget this because i said much earlier that I was going to give you another answer to uh

uh shadow work um well another possibility if need be

um EMDR work or hypnosis which i also do so so if if a if a

therapist in the future who’s following this um uh mode of therapy uh

psychospiritual therapy through gnostic pneumatherapy wants to do this they can do hypnosis

where if the person’s mind is going in this direction giving them lots of uh

um let’s say seven deadly sins in their life or illusions of ignorance as i call

then obviously the hypnosis may help them to have their uh patterns go in that direction instead

to get better results right and clear up the pathway to make it more

easier for them to have better dreams or visions you name it okay

uh also there’s EMDR work uh you know that the eye uh

bilateral stimulation, have you heard about EMDR? yeah but please yes explain to

those who might not know please right to do a trauma as you were saying earlier um where they can go back to their early

target memory uh maybe some kind of trauma they experienced as a child let’s say

which brought forth a bad core belief in themselves

and by working through that uh traumatic uh memory

emotionally of course so there’s a lot of ab reaction that’s happening uh throughout the process why does

bilateral stimulation happening it’s where the um uh

the brain as they would say or maybe dr Stephan A. Hoeller would say the mind you know

helps to let go of some of that unnecessary old stuff and new information comes forth that

they might have forgotten about oh yeah but I forgot that my uncle was there for me during that time

or god spoke to me during that time you see so they start to integrate those

positive memories um and they start to no longer feel like uh i can’t but rather i can

you know as their core belief as a person you know and so EMDR 

does tap on some of those lower chakras as well as some of the higher ones so

does hypnosis and then, of course especially active imagination as Carl Gustav Jung was talking about, that’s really up there with the chakras so so they’re all like brother sister

at least at least i feel that emdr , hypnosis and active imagination

like dreams they’re all hitting on the chakras to help us to cleanse them and

get to the crown chakra if you will uh or back to them or to going beyond

that back to the source, makes yeah makes sense what a great

a suite of uh tools and so for each person that you have an uh consultation in fact

this would be a good time to uh show the audience your website

so they could know of course we’ll have this in the show notes

and everybody you give a free assessment and everybody has a different path

depending on their needs if a person wants a free 15-minute uh uh

consultation by me they can definitely uh do that yeah and also there’s an

assessment there if they want to see yeah am i really depressed am i really anxious

and again let me um reiterate that uh

divine life therapy is just the beginning doorway to my actual contribution to the

field of psychology and that is gnostic pneumotherapy and analysis

so that that’s where my big heartfelt writing is gnostic pneumatherapy and analysis

um divine life therapy is just a doorway because i have some people yeah

because i have some people come to me and they may not want to do the elongated in-depth path work like

like the ancient greek mysteries you know they might want just to come

and on a more light level psycho spiritually talk about their depression or their marital life

or formal life but other people may want to go even beyond that

and say no, I want this lifetime experience of doing the actual path work

because since uh when does god have any limitations right god has the no limitations

the divine goes on forever so even if this therapeutic relationship ends one

day the path still goes on right

and your book uh is your book out or when is your book coming out joseph

well, let’s talk about the divine about that one yeah well i give a publisher now um

i have had uh the seven out of the eight chapters uh reviewed

and uh given me some feedback that I’m working on right now and I’m finishing up my eighth chapter which is the final

chapter so you know I give some uh

updates once in a while on my website for people to find out when the book is going to come out

um which I encourage you folks to uh pick up a copy when it does come out

um just remember the book was primarily written for professionals

to utilize this psychospiritual approach which is just like the mindfulness people

but the only difference is this is from a western perspective right so

to utilize this method in their um uh private practice of psychotherapy

for those who want to take a psychospiritual approach but of course, anybody can pick up a

copy uh I’ve had uh patients in the past uh out of the blue hey guess what i ordered

your uh first book your second book Gnostic Pneumotherapy is my third book

so that you know and um so people could do whatever they feel is best uh even if it’s a

patient or an initiate if they want to pick up a copy but even if they didn’t pick up a copy the

a therapist is going to use different excerpts from the book in order to get them to step by step

through the therapeutic mysteries and then into the spiritual mysteries

the therapeutic mysteries is more paper pencil work where they’re learning about

the mythology of Sophia and what is your version of the mythology of Sophia and

then they graduate from that into the spiritual mysteries where it becomes more ethereal in nature

where were we start to look more about how the visions

come about for example let’s say um let’s say that um

you have a vision and I am your Abraxis or you know or i

am your um Philemon you know and we kind of do a little role play let’s say

of acting out how to do dialogue and assimilation as we look at other people’s examples of

that like dr Robert Johnson who’s a famous Jungian analyst

we may use some of his examples um so that way down the road when the initiate

goes through what I call the foursome process for some process meaning

um you do the method and there are many methods you can use to get an active imagination experience

going and then after that you have the divine experience and then you have the documentation the

recording of that and then fourth is analysis now let’s analyze

through your documentation the experience you just had right

and so you see that whole foursome process helps to

uh enlighten the person through the gnosis they received but then they got to go back around again and again and

again and again kind of like Dante in his circle of life

in inferno Purgatorio Paradiso over and over again as the person

becomes more individuated more complete, more whole

more of a gnosis integration process to have that gnosis integration in the end

which is the same thing as the oneness one with the source being one with

your truest self and when you have that then like we said earlier that’s when the bulb is

totally enlightened and it brings off many positive vibes and rays of

light to the world this is the way to help make the world a better place one person at a time by

following your bliss as Joseph Campbell says to have this

enlightenment and therefore be a good uh uh light source in the world that people

will become magnetized to want to do the same for some process

via gnostic pneumotherapy hopefully or other or other pathways as well that’s out there like Buddhism

uh you name it so that they as well can mindfully become

whom we were all meant to be in this world an alien of this world to be more

of a weirdo a stranger like Jesus christ or the buddha but you see

they were crazy in the right way though

okay because to be crazy in the wrong way is hurtful but to be crazy in the right way or mad

is not really a madness but as Plato called a divine madness

and that’s what I’m all about is helping people to help themselves to attain

that divine madness uh because that kind of madness

is worth writing books about, its healing it’s beyond the limitations

of how’s the weather

okay beautifully said yes I love it yeah it reminds me for some reason two quotes by

Carl Jung when he said we didn’t come to this world to be good we came to be whole like he said we came to be ourselves and

what else did he say show me a sane man and I will cure him so divine madness that ecstasy that the

gods have or want from us

wonderful yeah love your message and agree with you on the active imagination and everything else I’m so excited about

everything you’re doing for the audience to get to find out more about you just go to your website or there are other ways to uh get a hold of you yes and I still have my old gnostic

pneumotherapy website out there as well but is the main one

that’ll also lead you into the pneumotherapy uh tab and um

our uh can i give a phone number yeah of course of course and i will put this on the show notes too as well for those who

want to read so our uh front office number is 818-877-4647 and um we would uh love to hear from you who

whomever you are we welcome everybody wonderful yes get into that path work

one way or another, well joseph this has been a wonderful conversation definitely look forward to talking to you when your

book comes out and uh keep the dialogue going with Philemon our higher selves our lower selves

everybody needs a dialogue even our shadow that needs to be so I love what you’re doing; thank you so

much so you might actually invite me back yes yes

you and all your other complexes and shadow and higher they’re all welcome here we’ll fit you in of course so

okay blessings too; thank you so much you and everybody else and uh peace to everybody and there you have it a

fascinating interview with dr Lancaster very Jungian and dr Stephan A. Hoelle, and yes I am going to get a haircut soon but god, there’s so much to do so no

time thinking of a haircut is like well i think i understand Ted Kaczynski or

Albert einstein how they let their hair go and others too because again uh this

gnosis is just too fascinating but I have to get it done anyway beyond my hair

it’s great to see the Jungian path it’s great to understand that we all should

go inward or outward to alternate states of consciousness

i mean Jung basically rift off the gnostics and the gnostics basically rift

off those ancient shamans who decided that so many answers are found outside of our

normative thinking uh call it the spirit world call it the collective unconscious

call it whatever you want; the answers are there and it’s a great place to

explore for so many insights and so much healing

Philip k dick did say that since the universe is made of information then it can be said that information

will save us mystics and even new agers always talk about everything is consciousness and

everything is one well if that’s the case then the universe reality itself everything is

communicating with us and the key according to the gnostics and of course Jung is always to be

listening to some of the best news I ever had was that uh there was nothing wrong with me my

alcoholism my drug addiction my um severe manic depression

were based on the idea that I wasn’t listening to my soul or the gods or

to the collective unconscious again call it whatever you want and uh that i needed to listen to better i

mean let’s face it the soul is your shadow your childhood selves your complexes

your ancestors they’re always talking to us they want to see it at the table of

the ego because they have information for us and at the end of the day they

want to be integrated so when I realized that depression

anxiety mood swings wanting to get high was basically me not

wanting to listen or me not listening to these voices to that energy to that

communication well everything got better especially when I started finding the techniques to

listen i started doing meditation therapy, active imagination exercises

uh dream journaling all that to listen to what was coming up that wanted to

integrate with me and truly offered insights and avenues into what my

the purpose was and at the end of the day led me slowly to my authentic self i

still have a lot of work to do but things got better don’t get me wrong is uh John Lennon

said whatever gets you through the night you have to do what you have to do to feel

better to get a little breathing room but I would advise pivoting toward this

the idea of listening to your ancestors listening to that uh

wounded child listening to the shadows that are telling you you don’t want to be something but you have to face it; you

have to go into the underworld for those demons and then as I keep saying everything

gets much better and that’s really the secret of gnosis that’s the secret of

the mysticism that’s the secret of this universe that is all information

we just have to learn to listen and that in itself really is a mystical

experience it’s astral travel; it is going through those waves of information that go beyond this

the world into other dimensions, so I hope with this interview and what i said you

have this information and hopefully you can walk through those

doors with the god of the mind i hope you are also ready or closer to laying your

cards on the table and as both joseph Campbell and mary

Magdalene said to become transparent to the transcendent

because there are a lot of blockages which e with each one of us and when that

a blockage is gone we really do become transparent to everything that is out there and

everything that is urging us for our higher purpose and to find our authentic self

Thank You.

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